Ducati Monster Motorcycle Forum banner

1 - 20 of 109 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
65 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Hi I just bought my first brand spanking new Ducati Monster M800 Dark. Wooohooo or so I thought. I hadn't even run 140 miles on it before the engine stopped shifting.

So Halfway through my first road trip I was calling for a tow back to the dealership. Now I have a brand new bike that has been sitting in the shop of the dealership for the last 5 days.

They are telling me that they need to take the engine completely apart while on the phone with Ducati to walk them through the dismantling. This is all so Ducati knows what replacement parts they need to send out to repair the busted engine.

Well that is all well and good, Ducati is holding up their end of the warranty, but, and tell me if I am crazy here, I feel like I shouldn't have to have a rebuilt engine. I mean I *JUST* bought it. I hadn't had it for a week yet. This was the first time I even took it for any kind of a ride, and it completely breaks down. Even if they are able to locate a "broken part" and can ship out a replacement, I bought a *NEW* bike, not a "good as new" or "like new", or in actuality a bike with a rebuilt engine.

Ok so there is my dilemma. I have been looking around on the web for options, and it is not looking good. My strongest hope was the "Lemon Law" which states that any motor vehicle that you purchase should be free of major defects, and if not, you are legally allowed to ask for a replacement. Unfortunately though Hawaii's law made a specific exception to mopeds, and motorcycles.

If anyone has any advice for me legal or otherwise, I would be much appreciative. I have not gotten hard ass with either the dealership or with Ducati North America, as I was hoping they would see, what I see to be obvious, that I was sold a malfunctioning Ducati and that they should replace it, lock stock and engine, with a working one.


Thanks
Jonathan

As a footnote, my dealership has been about as unhelpful as they possibly could be.
* It took them hours to "prep" the bike when I picked it up even though they had assured me it would be ready when I arrived.
* Due to a series of so called "miscommunications" on their side it took them 4.5 hours to get a tow to me when the bike broke down, by which time their shop had closed for the weekend leaving me a few days without even finding out what happened with my bike.
* They have not once called me back for a status update though they have assured me they would. I have had to hound them for the little info I have about what is wrong, often having to have some manager "talk" to the person I am asked to deal with.

All-in-all this Ducati is leaving a really, really bad taste in my mouth. I am sitting here bike-less, feeling like I just got scammed out of $10G.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
136 Posts
Man, that is one horror story. I have an 800 like yours and I am happy to say.....Zero problems. In fact, when I read some of the posts here about problems encountered I can't believe I have the same bike. Man, it's like I got one of the good ones.
Enough about my bike..........YOU deserve a NEW bike! No question. I would demand it! Be nice. Be diplomatic. Write the appropriate letters. If this does not work.....get some legal help. If all else fails......kill 'em all. ;)
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
72 Posts
Sounds like you have not had much luck with your ducati or your dealership. Let me guess who the dealership is..........ummmm.... South Seas Honda on Nimitz by the airport? is that right? If so, I do everything in the world to stay away from that dealership...They are just plain a**holes there. I cannot tell you how many times I have been in there just looking at all the bikes, and everyone ignores you. But since you bought your bike from there (only place that sells duc.), I guess you have to take it there :-/. One place that I have never had a bad experience at is Cycle Sports in Iweli (i think thats how you spell it). They say they dont work on ducati's but I talked a mechanic into working on it, btw the mechanic is a ducati mechanic and he also worked at South Seas Honda, but I dont know if he still works at cycle sports.
I did not know that bikes and mopeds are excluded from the lemon law. My parents bought a boat and it was always breaking down. Finally after many times of calling the boat manufacturer, we got a one year newer, a couple feet longer, better color scheme, and faster boat because my dad claimed it as a lemon.
Oh yeah p.s. another good place that works on ducatis is Superbikes Hawaii, I have not taken my bike there but i know a guy who had a monster but now he has a 998 and him and his friends dont take it anywhere but there.
 
R

·
Guest
Joined
·
0 Posts
What exactly happened and can you get a list of what needs to be replaced, as I am not sure why it would be a full engine rebuild?
It may help allay some of your concerns if you could post more info
for the wrenches that post here to see what is involved.
Are M800's really 10g's?
Sorry to hear of your troubles....
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
5,076 Posts
If it just stopped shifting, it is probably a shift dog, lever, or drum problem, & has nothing to do with the motor. The fix is pretty easy, but it takes some dissassembly to access the parts. I'd hound them to take it apart, but wouldn't "play hardball" until you know exactly what the problem is. If it were my dealership, I would have located the problem the same day you brought it in. You could always ask for a replacement bike under the grounds that you're being denyed useage of a brand new bike, & see if that flies, but if it were me, I'd be pitching a bitch about the lack of use of a new bike with 140 miles on it, more than worried about a repaired "new" bike.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
259 Posts
I'd check your local lemon laws and assert them in writting. You will probably have additional problems as a result of the rebuilt and there is no reason to take that on a new bike. If the mechanic (who can't do the rebuild on his own - scary) screws up, you should get to undo the transaction. Normally on life threatening stuff the mfg gets one chance to fix it. gear box on a cycle should qualify for one rebuild. The reality is the mechanic will not get it right and no MFG will risk having to write-off a lemon when they can rebuild it and sell it as a new demo bike. I've had a Chevy and MB bought back. You need to stick to your rights, document everything and stand up for yourself.

I'd also check to see if you have the title yet. In some states the mfg only gets so many days to get it to you before the transaction is void. If they have not submitted the paperwork yet, tell them not to and to keep the bike as "new." Let them undo the transaction. There are some good lemon law cites - use them and do everything in writting. Your dealer needs to be kept happy, but he is not on your side.

Ducati NA reads this board. They should be tracking you down and should do the right thing.

You should be on the phone with them and faxing your lemon law notice. They should take the bike back and/or get you another new one - period.
 
Z

·
Guest
Joined
·
0 Posts
I agree with the board. I would place a call to Ducati NA and fight for a new bike. Chances are that even IF your dealer was on your side and wanted to give you a new bike, they would have to take it up with Ducati as well to make sure that they can sell the
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7 Posts
Ok this sucks.

Do you have any friends that are attorneys? A strongly-worded letter from somone who has, "esq." after their name can help a lot. If not there is still much you can do.

Tell your dealer that you are unhappy and that you will be contacting DNA. Write a letter to DNA and copy your dealer on it (I'd copy the owner and the GM of the dealer). Outline your complaints without drama or explitives. Be nice and very matter of fact. If the facts are on your side here (it sounds like they are), you needn't waste time or energy by being inflamatory. Simply write what happened as if you were reporting it. Tell them that you are not happy and appeal to them to help.

Above all, remain calm. Nothing kills the credibility of a complaint faster than a hysterical tone.

If the letter is not written by a lawyer, avoid talk of law! Trust me that you don't know enough about how it works to reference it in a letter. Again, an incorrect claim of legal rights can kill the credibility of a letter.

Good luck.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
413 Posts
I had a very similar problem with my s4R. The clutch froze the second day I owned it and it had to be towed. Turns out the nut that holds the clutch basket on had come loose. Took about ten days to get it back, however my dealer was very nice through the whole thing. I hope yours turns out to be something equally as simple. I would wait for a diagnosis before I would do anything. I know how you feel and I am completly sympathetic.Hopefully if its something serious, your dealer or DNA will do the right thing which is to get you a new bike.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,928 Posts
I agree with Norm here. >

I'd hound them to take it apart, but wouldn't "play hardball" until you know exactly what the problem is. I'd be pitching a bitch about the lack of use of a new bike with 140 miles on it, more than worried about a repaired "new" bike.
The problem might be something relatively minor that's just a PITA to get to. Find out what the problem is before turning this into a "federal case". You may have to be dealing with this shop for the next two years if you want warranty service and no sense alienating them unless you have to. Even if your state's "Lemon Law" covers motorcycles, lemon laws typically only come into play when there are multiple problems depriving you the use of your vehicle over a period of time. Not the first time it breaks down. It's unfortunate that your bike is sick so soon, but nothing mechanical is 100% all the time, that's why there is a warranty in the first place.
I can understand you're feeling the way you do, but get all the facts first before you go ballistic.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
259 Posts
You need to research your rights and stick it to Duc.

At the very least they should be crating your dealer a new engine.

If it was me, I'd file a pro se complaint against the mfg and the dealer. Let their attorney spend time and money to convince a judge and/or jury that they can sell a 8k product that blows up after 140 miles and allow a mechanic who needs to be talk through the repair fix it.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
65 Posts
Discussion Starter #15
Wow!!!

Man what a community. Thank you all for your advice.

What exactly happened and can you get a list of what needs to be replaced, as I am not sure why it would be a full engine rebuild?
It may help allay some of your concerns if you could post more info
for the wrenches that post here to see what is involved.
Are M800's really 10g's?
Sorry to hear of your troubles....
All I know is that the bike stopped shifting. I was in third, picking up speed on the highway, with no problems. I tried to shift up in to fourth, and nothing. I tried to shift down in case it was just stuck, and that worked (though a little rough), so now I was in second, so I tried to shift up again, and it wouldn't budge. Again I shifted down (now in first) and again could not shift up. At this point I have the clutch in as I was going way to fast for 1st gear, and I start trying to edge over to right hand lane and off the highway so I can figure out what is going on.
Ok so using my hand and a LOT of pressure I was able to "jam" the gear into neutral. I say jam because it definatly did not sound smoothe.

Also, and this may be important.... From the moment I first picked up the bike from the store it refused to start in gear with the clutch engaged. It simply would not turn over. It would only start in neutral. I have some friends with 03 monsters and know that you should be able to start in first with the clutch engaged. I told my sales guy about the problem and he said it was no big deal, I should not be doing that anyway and should wait till the 600 mile tune-up to have it looked at, or I may end up having to pay for the service. Could this be related?

Also the reason why it took them so long to hand over the bike in the first place was because the original battery refused to hold a charge so they had to swap it out for another one.

(To me these are yet other signs that this bike was a dud, but I may be over reacting)

so where was I... oh yeah, i was saying that I didn't know what was wrong with the bike.
Ok so here is an overview of my dealings with the shop/dealership thus far:
*I picked up the bike on Monday of last week
*Saturday was my first free day to actually ride it.
*3/4 of the way through the ride it breaks.
*The bike is towed on sat evening to the shop
*Monday I call in first thing to tell the mechanic what happened. After a hassle on the phone with them, about me having to trek all the way over there to sign a release form for them to even look at the bike, they agree to call me back around noon with some info.
*Around 2 pm I call them back to find out what is wrong. This is when the mechanic tells me something to the effect of:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
65 Posts
Discussion Starter #17
without getting into specifics, the above post is correct. so-called, "lemmon laws" generally protect against the same thing going wrong after repeated attempts to fix it.

The "free from defects" thing that the original poster referenced is actually an implied warranty of merchantability (which can be, and probably was, disclaimed by the language in the DNA warranty). For more reading, google the Magnusson Moss Act and read to your heart's content.

Have you read the DNA warranty yet? If so, do it. It will let you know what your RIGHTS are (as opposed to what you think you are entitled to). Your rights are usually very limited under consumer warranties (again, read the M-M Act - its possible that some provisions in the DNA warranty are not enforcable). Teams of lawyers have gone over that warranty and wrote it so that DNA does not have to cover anything more than what Federal and State law requires.

With that in mind, you're probably simply asking DNA to be nice guys and take care of a customer. This is not the same as DNA being in the position to fulfill some kind of legal obligation. How you go about asking for each thing is VERY different. Adjust your tone accordingly.

Cheers.

Thanks. Yeah I read the Dealer warrenty, and it is, well not very detailed. It say it will replace defective parts, then spends the rest of the time discussing limitations to the warrenty... cant go off road, cant race it. can't modify the bike in any way etc. etc. Nothing about replacing a brand new bike that does not work.

I will read through the Magnusson Moss Act. If it is the Lemon Law though. I am affraid that I don't have a legal leg to stand on as the Hawaii Lemon Law specifically exludes motorcycles

"Motor vehicle" means a self-propelled vehicle primarily designed for the transportation of persons or property over public streets and highways which is used primarily for personal, family, or household purposes. For purposes of this definition, a "motor vehicle" also includes a "demonstrator", which means a vehicle assigned by a dealer for the purpose of demonstrating qualities and characteristics common to vehicles of the same or similar model or type, but does not include mopeds, motorcycles, or motor scooters, as those terms are defined in chapter 286, or vehicles over 10,000 pounds, gross vehicle weight rating. For purposes of this definition, a "motor vehicle" also includes (1) an individually registered vehicle used for an individual's business purposes and for personal, family, or household purposes; and (2) a vehicle owned or leased by a sole proprietorship, corporation or partnership which has purchased or leased no more than one vehicle per year, used for household, individual, or personal use in addition to business use.
I tried to find the claus in HI Law chapter 286, but that is a huge chapter and I cannot find anything in it about motorcycle lemon laws.

Basically I agree with what a lot of you are saying, It is important how I approach my dealer/shop/DNA etc. I am no lawyer and don't think I have a lot of room legally anyway. I am really hoping that somwhere between the dealer and DNA someone will think, wow we just sold this guy a 10G pile of $hit and we should probably do something to make it right. I wanted to ask you all advice, since you love Ducati so much. Maybe you could clue me in on whether this seemed like a reasonable hope.

BTW, I said it before and I will say it again, What a great community you guys have going here. With all the feed back, I really don't feel so alone and screwed.

Please Keep it comming.

I will post updates on the status of this mess as I get them.

Thanks again,
Jonathan
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
65 Posts
Discussion Starter #18
Sorry to hear about all that. I hope it gets better soon. I bet that first 140 miles was great though huh?

Yes.... Yes it was, I had just gotten out of the water from a great dawn patrol surf session on the north shore and was cruising down the coast. :)
 
R

·
Guest
Joined
·
0 Posts
thanks...for the info....I think the way it works, I could be wrong is the dealer needs to bill Ducati, to get reimbursed, the dealer then needs to make sure the work done get's approved for payment....if that is correct it may be the reason why they would go over the engine in that manner.
Still I would suggest a calm yet firm application of daily pressure on the dealer and DNA to assist you in getting back on the road, they will want to get you out quicker and make sure you won't be back with another problem...I would also want to talk to the mechanic to find out what is going to be done and replaced. It may just be the gearbox which is not a full engine rebuild.
with the helmets and stuff price seems inline....I know it is hard to get
a bike with problems out of the box....
 
1 - 20 of 109 Posts
Top