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Discussion Starter #1
So here's my problem...

2014 M1200S with 24,000KM on the odom.

Everything works well... until I hit the power on hard (say to pass on highway).. the front cylinder then stops providing power... runs like a one cylinder thumper. She can still power me off to a safe location but not happily. I know it's the front cylinder because I've check a few time the heat from the headers and the front is always colder then the rear.

I stop, kill switch the engine, wait 3 seconds, press start and she purrs back to life with both cylinders like nothing is wrong.

Doesn't happen all the time, but it started this late this spring. First time I noticed was when I just rolled into the parking lot at work, no hard pull being done. Second time was on highway when trying to over take, then I really knew something was wrong because I lost significant power. It has happened about a total of 6 to 8 times, she's my daily driver to get to work. Out of all the times it happened the check engine light has appeared about 3 times. Of the 3 times, I only saw the dash spit out a code once and it didn't stay on for long (and yes I didn't memorize it).

Asking some mechanic friends and biker friends, most said it sounded like a coil issue. Research online has provided very little info for the M1200S dropping the front cylinder compared to older models of the monster because of coil issues, but the logic to the problem was sound.

So I replaced the coils with a used set from a 2017 M1200S hoping this would solve the problem.... sadly it hasn't. Rode a week with no issues until today. Both coil rails gave almost the identical Ohms when tested. I have yet to test the cables but pulling the bike apart is a longer job I currently have time for seeing that I use the bike daily.

I've pulled 2 of the 4 plugs (side plugs) to check their gaps, one was at 0.86mm the other 0.91mm so within spec. I've ordered 4 new plugs regardless, even if the plugs are rated to 50K miles. https://www.ngk.com/product.aspx?zpid=9900

But I really don't believe this will cure the problem as it doesn't have logic to be the cause, because the issue is intermittent and I don't think 2 plugs would fail on the same cylinder.

I've got the shop and parts manuals and have been racking my brain as to what would cause an intermittent problem such as this. I'm still thinking it's an electrical issue, as fuel or air would just to me not be as intermittent... so either the injector or ECU (seriously hope not). So far searches on both have provided nothing.

And yes I do plan on going to the dealer and having the codes pulled, but thought I'd throw this puzzle onto the forum to see if others might have some ideas of what to check.

Thanks for any help.
 

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So here's my problem...



2014 M1200S with 24,000KM on the odom.



Everything works well... until I hit the power on hard (say to pass on highway).. the front cylinder then stops providing power... runs like a one cylinder thumper. She can still power me off to a safe location but not happily. I know it's the front cylinder because I've check a few time the heat from the headers and the front is always colder then the rear.



I stop, kill switch the engine, wait 3 seconds, press start and she purrs back to life with both cylinders like nothing is wrong.



Doesn't happen all the time, but it started this late this spring. First time I noticed was when I just rolled into the parking lot at work, no hard pull being done. Second time was on highway when trying to over take, then I really knew something was wrong because I lost significant power. It has happened about a total of 6 to 8 times, she's my daily driver to get to work. Out of all the times it happened the check engine light has appeared about 3 times. Of the 3 times, I only saw the dash spit out a code once and it didn't stay on for long (and yes I didn't memorize it).



Asking some mechanic friends and biker friends, most said it sounded like a coil issue. Research online has provided very little info for the M1200S dropping the front cylinder compared to older models of the monster because of coil issues, but the logic to the problem was sound.



So I replaced the coils with a used set from a 2017 M1200S hoping this would solve the problem.... sadly it hasn't. Rode a week with no issues until today. Both coil rails gave almost the identical Ohms when tested. I have yet to test the cables but pulling the bike apart is a longer job I currently have time for seeing that I use the bike daily.



I've pulled 2 of the 4 plugs (side plugs) to check their gaps, one was at 0.86mm the other 0.91mm so within spec. I've ordered 4 new plugs regardless, even if the plugs are rated to 50K miles. https://www.ngk.com/product.aspx?zpid=9900



But I really don't believe this will cure the problem as it doesn't have logic to be the cause, because the issue is intermittent and I don't think 2 plugs would fail on the same cylinder.



I've got the shop and parts manuals and have been racking my brain as to what would cause an intermittent problem such as this. I'm still thinking it's an electrical issue, as fuel or air would just to me not be as intermittent... so either the injector or ECU (seriously hope not). So far searches on both have provided nothing.



And yes I do plan on going to the dealer and having the codes pulled, but thought I'd throw this puzzle onto the forum to see if others might have some ideas of what to check.



Thanks for any help.
I'd double check the horizontal plug wire is routed behind the secondary air hose...if it isn't the fan will cut it...had this problem on my m821...it was pretty obvious but you have dual spark...might help hide it...check the plug wire for starters


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Discussion Starter #3
Thanks Buhgaboo, looks like I'm pulling the tank tomorrow.
 

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Thanks Buhgaboo, looks like I'm pulling the tank tomorrow.
This plug is just behind the radiator...you should be able to see 1 that it's behind the secondary air line and 2 trace the line with your fingers looking for breaks

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Buhgaboo.... this look familiar.


Thanks a million. [thumbsup] Next cable will be covered with loom to protect it from the sharp edges of the fan shroud. C'mon Ducati... such an amateur thing to cause.
 

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Buhgaboo.... this look familiar.





Thanks a million. [thumbsup] Next cable will be covered with loom to protect it from the sharp edges of the fan shroud. C'mon Ducati... such an amateur thing to cause.
You should be ok without it...just be certain it's routed behind the secondary air line...it's so natural to put it in front of it...and for real...who would have thought the fan could saw through anything....palm to face

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Discussion Starter #7
You should be ok without it...just be certain it's routed behind the secondary air line...it's so natural to put it in front of it...and for real...who would have thought the fan could saw through anything....palm to face

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Should be doesn't make me confortable... OCD.. lol... A quick rub of some sand paper to brake the edge off the fan will also help.

Was going to oder the plug but the local dealer has to order it direct from Bologna and said it's a 12 day wait min. On top of the $70 Can pesos for it, so I told them to forget it. I would of easily paid the $70 if the delay was reasonable, but I'm not waiting 12 days during some of the best riding weather of the year. Looked around to just change out the cable itself and reuse the boots, but that's not so easy. So I'll do the old silicon on the wire to stop the voltage leak and order the part over the winter.

I hate dealers. Thanks again for all the help.
 

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Should be doesn't make me confortable... OCD.. lol... A quick rub of some sand paper to brake the edge off the fan will also help.



Was going to oder the plug but the local dealer has to order it direct from Bologna and said it's a 12 day wait min. On top of the $70 Can pesos for it, so I told them to forget it. I would of easily paid the $70 if the delay was reasonable, but I'm not waiting 12 days during some of the best riding weather of the year. Looked around to just change out the cable itself and reuse the boots, but that's not so easy. So I'll do the old silicon on the wire to stop the voltage leak and order the part over the winter.



I hate dealers. Thanks again for all the help.
I'd still order the part....but try flooding the cut with silicone and wrapping it with tape...the problem only exists when it's exposed...another thought is to move the other plug wire to there...the second wire is more or less for efficiency ..my 821 only uses the one ...just some thoughts...I hate waiting on dealer parts and typically buy everything over seas because it's half the cost but can also be twice the wait. .but not always ...especially with a large order...I can beat my dealer on parts typically if the order is big enough.... nonetheless...you need a new plug wire ...try taping it so it doesn't expose the bare wire...or swapping the side wire for the top... honestly I'm not familiar enough with the 1200 but my 821 only acted up when things were warmed up and good and flexible...look closely...it's the silicone efi sheathing that's cut...the cable is stainless cable...no plastic fan blade is going through that....but exposing it to the air is catastrophic...try putting it under compression and tape it until the new one arrives

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Discussion Starter #9
I'd still order the part....but try flooding the cut with silicone and wrapping it with tape...the problem only exists when it's exposed...another thought is to move the other plug wire to there...the second wire is more or less for efficiency ..my 821 only uses the one ...just some thoughts...I hate waiting on dealer parts and typically buy everything over seas because it's half the cost but can also be twice the wait. .but not always ...especially with a large order...I can beat my dealer on parts typically if the order is big enough.... nonetheless...you need a new plug wire ...try taping it so it doesn't expose the bare wire...or swapping the side wire for the top... honestly I'm not familiar enough with the 1200 but my 821 only acted up when things were warmed up and good and flexible...look closely...it's the silicone efi sheathing that's cut...the cable is stainless cable...no plastic fan blade is going through that....but exposing it to the air is catastrophic...try putting it under compression and tape it until the new one arrives

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Already done. I had some high temp RTV silicone laying around from another project that I used on the cable, then I put a piece of silicon loom over the cut to protect it more.

Unfortunately the cables aren't interchangeable. The secondary or side plug cable has a standard boot and is also shorter than the main cable. I actually performed the same repaire to it as the cable was rubbing on the water pump filter and wore a flat spot on the cable (see pic). So far the repairs seems to be holding.

I will order a new cable... but only once she's hibernating for the winter. I'm actually trying to find a set of performance cables as this whole experience has made me realize how unimpressive the stock cables and boots are.

20190901_113430.jpg

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Discussion Starter #10
So reviving my original thread as the issue for my bike is STILL not resolved.

After changing all spark plugs and wires to new, which did not resolve my problem, I decided to bring the bike to a dealer and have them pull all the error codes that came up.

So out of the 10 error codes pulled 2 were of the most interest. P0351 & P0352 = Ignition coil A/B primary and secondary circuit malfunction.

The tech said it was the front coil that failed. But I wasn't convinced because I had previously swapped both front and back coils and the issues still happened on ONLY the front cylinder.

I now have 4 coils (2 original 2 used I picked up). None of which cured the power loss problem when I swapped them to the front cylinder.

The cables all seem fine, but I haven't checked continuity simply because I can't find the electrical schematics to show which pin on the CPU unit to test.

Normally I would suck it up and just pay the $170+15% tax CAN for a stupid coil, but if it end up not working I'm out that cash which would of been used for a new CPU unit.

Any ideas my fellow duck masters?

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Check plugs for torque...make sure there isn't any dielectric grease on the terminal ends of the wire...any chance on a video so we can hear it? Is it all the time or only hot/cold...I would pay close attention to the codes as a general area where the fault is occurring...give the terminals a good cleaning...check the chassis ground for corrosion
 

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**Check plugs for torque

-Done at dealer.

**make sure there isn't any dielectric grease on the terminal ends of the wire

-None ever put.

**...any chance on a video so we can hear it?

-https://youtu.be/ZF3ZCSdJdRM
-https://youtu.be/IvICQoykgug
-https://youtu.be/jYCQZ99PNvg

**Is it all the time or only hot/cold...I would pay close attention to the codes as a general area where the fault is occurring...give the terminals a good cleaning...check the chassis ground for corrosion

-All the time regardless of temp.
-The ground is clean as I changed the battery last fall and the 1200 requires the ground to be disconnected to remove the bat

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The fault said primary and secondary failure...which does elude to total failure of the coil...going upstream from there I believe is the ecu... pretending you swapped it and it still doesn't work...there's also a crank position sensor...but I'd feel that would hinder both cylinders....

...your getting heat in the cylinder so it's either a partial burn or intermittent failure...if it's the top plug working it would feel down on power...if it's the secondary plug that's working I imagine it would sound like it did in the video...you could swap upper and lower wires at the coil to see if it makes any audible difference...ruling out a downstream issue does help point in the right direction...ecu and any sensor the ecu uses to send the signal
 
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