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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
2000 Monster 750 Dark 20k 14t

I just replaced my clutch and installed a yoyodyne slave from ca-cycleworks. I got a Barnett kit from them too. I posted a thread about it in advance and put in Motul 3000 as advised.

When the bike is in gear, with the clutch disengaged, it pulls pretty hard. It will move the bike on a level surface, I can't find neutral with it running, and it shifts hard (CLUNK). On the plus side the clutch grabs really firmly and cranking the throttle is once again a religious experience. I'd like to be able to shift without jarring my teeth loose though.

Is this normal for a new clutch? Do I need to break it in? The friction zone feels like it is in the right place as far as lever travel. Could it be the yoyodyne? I have heard bad things about barnett, specifically that the plates don't fit very well.

The ducati service guy near me mentioned that one of the plates is "cone shaped" and should go in a specific order. My friend who is more experienced than I put in the plates, and he might not have paid attention to the order they went in. They all looked about the same to me ???

The guy at CA-Cycleworks also sold me some heavy duty barnett springs, but they are tight as f**k and I couldn't pull the lever even 1/4" with them installed. My stock springs were well over the minimum length, so I put them back in.

HELP! This is my daily driver.

tia

Edit (1/12/2007): Update on page 4. Long story short: It was a defective clutch stack from Barnett, but a replacement stack worked perfectly.
 

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Re: Clutch problems after plate replacement... Help!

Possible faults:

Air. Tie down the clutch lever with a ty-rap and let it sit all night. The compressed bubbles will escape from the line and slave and float up and away. I've also been able to remove air from the brake master bayonet bolt, loosen it a quarter turn, compress lever, tighten, release lever. Don't get brake fluid on your bike!! If all the air is gone...

The concave plate acts as a spring and it sounds like it is overdoing it, your clutch isn't disengaged properly. I have good results running without it... you could try that.
 

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Re: Clutch problems after plate replacement... Help!

Yes, and you can also substitute a thinner ducati steel plate for one of the Barnett ones, including the curved/bent plate. There may be a touch of break in, but I wouldn't think it dramatic. You didn't say if the bike was warm or cool, but when cool, heavy clunks and some drag is not uncommon as the clutch plates all stick together with the oil.

Are you Andrew? I got a message, but got v/m upon calling back...

Thanks,
Chris
 

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Re: Clutch problems after plate replacement... Help!

I put a slipper clutch in my s4rs and its harder to find neutral. Its easy when the bike it rolling (with engine running) but at a standstill its hard.

stock slave

Mark
 

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Re: Clutch problems after plate replacement... Help!

IIRC the barnett clutch plates are a bit thicker than the stock ducati ones - and the springs are a bit stronger.
i replaced my clutch with a barnett setup a while back, and at first it was impossible to get it into neutral - i took it back to my service guy and he played with it and made it a bit better - a few thousand miles later it's still a little tough to find neutral when it's cold, but once it's warmed up it's fine
perhaps something was installed incorrectly? i have the barnet springs and i can pull my clutch just fine.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Re: Clutch problems after plate replacement... Help!

Chris from ca-cycleworks has been extremely helpful. He walked me through what to look for and even helped me over the phone when we had it open.

My friend and I took it apart again and reinstalled the plates. We also bled the clutch.

There is no "cone" plate. I don't think I am missing one because there is no more room. I have friction plates on each end of the stack with drive plates sandwiched between them, alternating. It is so simple, there seems to be nothing I could have possibly ****ed up... It's a bunch of stacked plates in the basket and the round plate on the end is oriented to match the notched female post.

Initially after starting the bike - new oil, freshly installed plates - it would buck forward and stall. And I mean buck forward. After it warmed up, it just clunks pretty bad. Finding neutral is practically impossible at a dead stop and very difficult when rolling. I have to apply a lot of pressure to the shift lever to upshift. In fact, after riding a bit, I had almost pushed the little rubber grip on the shifter completely off.

I don't have the ducati drive plates, and they were old anyway. My friend thought they wouldn't be of any use and threw them away :-\

I basically need to know whether the clutch is going to wear in or something. I don't want to damage my transmission with rough shifts. I ride a lot. Should I think about getting Ducati plates?
 

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Re: Clutch problems after plate replacement... Help!

BTW, we talked about it more on the phone today... He didn't know about how some Ducatis require the shift to neutral to be while the bike is still rolling. This is a little bit of a compromise, but I believe considered "acceptable" within the Ducati fold.

Heavy clunk with shifting is normal, too. You're ratcheting the transmission between gears and they will engage quickly.

Good luck with that... like I suggested just ride your bike normally and let the thing wear in.

:) Chris
 

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Re: Clutch problems after plate replacement... Help!

Many clutch plates from Barnett are warped.
Makes for a very draggy clutch.
IMO...the stock ones are flatter and work better.
Most of the guys at SH.org run Suzuki plates, not Barnett, because the zuke ones are flatter.

..............................

"BTW, we talked about it more on the phone today... He didn't know about how some Ducatis require the shift to neutral to be while the bike is still rolling. This is a little bit of a compromise, but I believe considered "acceptable" within the Ducati fold. "

You mean there actually are motorcycles with multi plate clutches that will shift into neutral at a standstill with the engine running?

BMW's with single plate clutches like cars do it just fine.
 

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Re: Clutch problems after plate replacement... Help!

chris said:
BTW, we talked about it more on the phone today... He didn't know about how some Ducatis require the shift to neutral to be while the bike is still rolling. This is a little bit of a compromise, but I believe considered "acceptable" within the Ducati fold.

Heavy clunk with shifting is normal, too. You're ratcheting the transmission between gears and they will engage quickly.

Good luck with that... like I suggested just ride your bike normally and let the thing wear in.

:) Chris
this is exactly how my bike is (s4rs) with a yoyodyne slipper. completely acceptable in my book

mark
 

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Re: Clutch problems after plate replacement... Help!

I had similar problems installing a Ducati clutch pack in my 2000 900 monster. I bled the system as best I could (including cracking the nut at the master cylinder). I also took out one of the two metal plates closest to the motor. In the end I still couldn't get a full disengagement so I moved my clutch lever to its furtherest position from the bars. Presto fixed. I guess this could mean there's still some air in the system but after several bleeds I've given up on that one.

I don't care what the bike - a clutch should disengage completely.
 

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Re: Clutch problems after plate replacement... Help!

I think some aftermarket slave cylinders give less travel to reduce the force needed at the clutch lever. End result is that you need to put the lever at the furthest position from the bar to fully disengage the clutch.
 

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Re: Clutch problems after plate replacement... Help!

dakinebusa said:
You mean there actually are motorcycles with multi plate clutches that will shift into neutral at a standstill with the engine running?
Yep all of mine will exhibit his behavior
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Re: Clutch problems after plate replacement... Help!

opwierde said:
I think some aftermarket slave cylinders give less travel to reduce the force needed at the clutch lever. End result is that you need to put the lever at the furthest position from the bar to fully disengage the clutch.
Mine's not adjustable.
 

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Re: Clutch problems after plate replacement... Help!

sausage creature said:
Mine's not adjustable.
Yes it is. Look at your lever and you'll see a little hole with a screw in it. It's lock-tighted in at the factory and also has a spring in it to keep some pressure on it. Consensus on the board is don't touch it. It's an adjustment screw. If you've bled your system good, go ahead and use the screw to finish your set-up. The barnett clutches work fine but it's not the same set-up as the ducati factory.
 

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Re: Clutch problems after plate replacement... Help!

bikenbits said:
sausage creature said:
Mine's not adjustable.
Yes it is. Look at your lever and you'll see a little hole with a screw in it. It's lock-tighted in at the factory and also has a spring in it to keep some pressure on it. Consensus on the board is don't touch it. It's an adjustment screw. If you've bled your system good, go ahead and use the screw to finish your set-up.
The thing you need to be careful about (and moreso with the brake lever than the clutch, from a "likelyhood of disaster" point of view) is that you don't adjust it so far that the master piston doesn't move all the way back to the bypass port. It's possible (and a [search] through this tech forum will find people who've done this) to screw up that particular adjustment so that your clutch pumps up the system pressure when you pull it in, but doesn't fully release the pressure when you let it out - thats kinda bad on your clutch 'cause it'll lead to clutch slippage, it's seriously bad on your brakes 'cause it'll lead to the pads dragging on the disk which can become very very bad as the brake calipers and fluid start heating up and possibly clamping on...

Yes, you can adjust things with that screw, but please do it in an informed fashion - make sure you're aware of the possible consequences if you play with that screw in a ham fisted way. Ducati didn't just loktite that one in to try and make you buy expensive adjustable levers...

big
 

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Re: Clutch problems after plate replacement... Help!

Ian makes a very good point. The previous owner of my bike had adjusted that screw until the clutch slipped. It took a while for me to track down the slipping. I had put new a new clutch pack and springs in, and bled the system repeatedly. The master was pumping fine so that left only the screw. Learning by my own mistakes is bad enough..........
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Re: Clutch problems after plate replacement... Help!

It's been over a week and the bike still stalls when I put it into gear when I first start it up. Shifts are still really rough and it pops out of first gear occasionally. It's never done that before.

I would adjust the clutch lever, but the clutch fully releases only about 1/3" from the top. If I adjusted it, I don't think it would fully engage. the friction zone is just about where it was with my old plates. The main problem seems to be drag.

Any ideas?
 

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Re: Clutch problems after plate replacement... Help!

my bike will sometimes stall when it is cold and put in gear. Once warm it never does it. Maybe the shifting problems are related to something else?

my 02c
 

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Re: Clutch problems after plate replacement... Help!

sausage creature said:
It's been over a week and the bike still stalls when I put it into gear when I first start it up. Shifts are still really rough and it pops out of first gear occasionally. It's never done that before.

I would adjust the clutch lever, but the clutch fully releases only about 1/3" from the top. If I adjusted it, I don't think it would fully engage. the friction zone is just about where it was with my old plates. The main problem seems to be drag.

Any ideas?
I would remove the concave "spring" plate and replace it with an ordinary steel one and see what happens.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Re: Clutch problems after plate replacement... Help!

opwierde said:
I would remove the concave "spring" plate and replace it with an ordinary steel one and see what happens.
This kit doesn't have a spring plate. Chris from ca-cycleworks mentioned they may include a normal drive plate instead with the barnetts. If I stuck anything else in there, it wouldn't disengage at all. It's just friction/drive/friction/... .../drive/friction. I used everything in the kit.
 
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