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Discussion Starter #1
You guys probably get this question alot and I probably did less searching than I should have but here goes:

Would the Monster make a good first bike?
I was at the dealership a week ago and the salesman recommended a 750sie then a 620 then an 800
From what I have heard I would think both the 750 and the 800 would be too much bike for a new rider to handle, but I guess I could be wrong and you could just change the sprockets to deliver less torque coming off the line.

Also, what prices are everyone talking the dealers into for these bikes these days?
 

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Welcome aboard. You'll find a ton of good info on this very topic if you check out the FAQ's and search through this board. Good luck.
 
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Discussion Starter #3
The main reason I ask is im not sure if this guy really cared about what bike he was selling and to whome. I understand hes getting commission and the 750 is going to get him more than a 620 but I would have felt better if I hadnt thought I could walk out of that shop with a 999 at my level of experience.
 
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TitX....you will get may opinions on this. However, an individual's ability to learn on a more powerful bike is greatly personality dependent. You never know how much control you will have over that addiction called acceleration - and there is a corelation between acceleration, bruised egos, broken bikes, and hospital visits.
My personal opinion is that any of the 600-750 Monsters are appropriate development bikes..........not first bikes. I think that most listers would agree that the first bike should be a "throw away" as it is going to fall down - with you on it or under it (and it would be a shame to subject a monster to such abuse).
Now, that being said, there are at least 4 used Monsters for sale in San Antonio that I know of (M600, M620ie, M750 Dark x2). Prices range from $4400.00 - $6000.00. I also know of several M900s (one, maybe two in Austin). These are priced a little higher (~$7000.00) and are probably more bike than you should be subjected to at this time. There may be more, these are just the ones that I'm aware of. Let me know if you need any additional information.
 

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Even an M900 is not excessive as far as power goes for a beginner. The V-twin doesn't have a sudden uncontrollable power hit like you might have with a 600cc inline-four sportbike.

As for changing the gearing to get less torque, that would also make it harder to ride when pulling away from a stop. You want to lower the gearing to make low speed maneuvers easier. Just about all Monsters benefit from a front sprocket with one less tooth or a rear sprocket with two more teeth. That's one of the first modifications I made to mine.

The only issue I would be concerned with has been mentioned already. Most new riders drop their bikes once or twice when they get in some awkward situation, like starting out uphill into a turn or making a tight turn on dirt or gravel. Having the bike fall over and getting a dented tank can be expensive. Broken turn signals and levers aren't quite so bad.

As with others, I would recommend a used bike that you won't cry over when you accidentally tip it over and scratch it or dent the tank. However, if you really want a new bike, the Monster 620 would be a good choice because it has a forgiving powerband, isn't too heavy, and has a good all around riding position. The M750 and M800 would also be good choices.
 

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Until this fall I hadn't rode a bike in almost 10 years. Had a buddy who was selling his cherry M900 Monster for a song. I took the MSF class, got my license and couldn't be happier with my 900. It has more than enough power for me and I've never thought it was too much bike. I just don't roll the throttle wide open between every gear, haven't had a problem yet with it being "too powerful". The money you save on a used bike leaves you extra to start modding it the way you want. I'm already looking at chopping the tail, putting new turn signals on, adding a tach and revalving the front forks this winter. Also with the "higher" end bikes you get more higher end parts like dual front discs and Showa forks that the budget bikes usually don't have standard. It's all what you're comfortable with and how you intend to ride it. I know I've matured since I was a crazy 18 year old in the Army and I don't push the envelope nearly as close as I did 10 years ago so I'm not worried that I'll go get drunk and end up killing myself with a big bike. FWIW,
Hanns
 

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my 620 is my first bike. I havn't felt that it is 'too much' bike, nor do I feel that it's 'too slow'.

I like it because I feel that it is nimble and friendly bike...
 

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I'd recommend buying mortocycling for dummies. Read it. They have a nice section on appropriate first bikes.

The Monster 620 and 800 (I think) are in the recommended list. There is a huge disclaimer though about how you are going to destroy your first bike so...buy with full knowledge and finacial ability.

After you read the book (and several other great texts like the Twist of the Wrist) figure out how much you have to spend. Price your gear (all of it and the best quality). Then price your insurance. Then deduct some cash for random stuff. How much to you have left? Buy accordingly. I'm not a fan of financing a bike you are going to drop and, more likely than not, destroy to some extent. You are better off saving insurance money and bike money, and buying something you can afford to ditch in a year or so. What if you are a klutz and riding is not for you? You do not want to be one of the ebay dudes who is selling a new bike at a steep discount (that has only been dropped once) and you have a loan to pay off.

The M620 is not my first bike, but I'd recommend one (assuming the finances work out). Used is a great option, but have someone who knows bikes check it out first (even if that means paying for an inspection at a dealer).
 

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You could probably pick a bike like this up for about $2500-$4000.
Tell me she isn't one sweet little ride ;)
Ahhhh...I miss my little Hawk :'(

 
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Discussion Starter #11
Would the Monster make a good first bike?
I was at the dealership a week ago and the salesman recommended a 750sie then a 620 then an 800
From what I have heard I would think both the 750 and the 800 would be too much bike for a new rider to handle, but I guess I could be wrong and you could just change the sprockets to deliver less torque coming off the line.
If you went to DucatiAustin, then there's a good chance Jeff was the gentleman you spoke to... I have seen how he reacts to people coming in to buy a bike... I went in there to buy an S4 as my first bike and he wouldn't even let me sign the paperwork... He's not there to sell you something you won't like or be able to handle... I guess what I'm saying is, most Ducati dealers won't sell you something you're going to wad up, if only for the fact that they don't want to see it first hand.
 
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I've never understood the "beginner bike" thing, at least as it relates to displacement.

For a beginner, a lighter, physically smaller bike is easier to deal with, but mostly for things like parking, wheeling it around, and very low speed maneuvers.

But it seems to me that the 600.750,900 Monsters are pretty close to the same physically. The 900 just has more power.

Nothing wrong with more power. If you are a beginner, just don't twist the throttle as far. I think that if you think that a 900 will have too much power for you to handle responsibly, and you need a 600 or 750 to limit yourself, then I'd suggest not getting a motorcycle at all, because a 600 or 750 is plenty dangerous in the hands of an irresponsible rider.

There is the cost thing - some believe that it's better to get a smaller displacement bike because they generally cost less and a beginner is going to ruin the bike. I disagree with that too. I've never bought a bike with the idea that I was going to wreck it or drop it. "Gee, I'd really like a 900 over the long haul, but since I know I'm going to dump it, maybe I should buy a 620, drop it, sell it for next to nothing (losing a ton of money), THEN buy a 900." Is that the logic? Doesn't make sense to me.
 
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Discussion Starter #13
Post wh0re edit:

Furthermore, if I were you... I'd go with either the 750S i.e. or the 800Dark...
 

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Look at it another way;

I'm in this for the long haul. I loved the Monster and meant to keep it a very long time. I did have an early mishap. Didn't have to happen and it probably wouldn't with the experience I have now. But some other confluence of conditions may bite my @ss any day!

So I had to have the tank dent reparied. Costs the same to repair a 600 tank as it does an S4R tank! The $300 I paid was gone whether I was repairing a "beginner" Monster or a "grown up" Monster. You could even look at is as a smaller percentage of the value of the larger bike.

Ergo, it's cheaper (in relative terms) to repair a crashed 900!

I expected that I'd want to upgrade to a 900 at some time if I started smaller. That would have cost more and I would have had a hell of a time convincing SWMBO that it was necessary!

I advocate buying a low mileage used bike. You save some coin and you can often get some of the upgrades you'll want anyway already installed. My used bike had 2200 miles, Termi slip-ons, a jet kit, DP analog dash kit and DP fender eliminator. Good Start!

As for displacement, consider primarily what you can afford.
 

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I just speak from my own personal experience. Although you have some points, and they make sense to us now, I maintain that the power issue is something that one should seriously consider.
It's interesting you mention the difference between the 600 and 900. On a personal note, it just happened that I went from an M620, purchased back in August, and I traded it for a M900 2 months later. I have almost 5 years of riding experience, 2 good spills and 4 great bikes to speak of. At any rate, it only took me 300 miles of riding the new 900 when I found myself in the oncoming lane, having underestimated the speed at which I had entered a turn in western MA in October. I was lucky no one was in the on-coming lane. I suppose my point is that I simply didn't expect the bike to do what it did. All of it was caused by my underestimation of the bikes entry speed-a direct function of engine power.
The old cliche' about falling applies, I believe, to everyone. Whether it's a spill at 70mph on a track to knocking the bike over in a clumsy parking lot turn, you'll fall someday.
It's just my opinion, but I believe taking it easy from the beginning on a bike with limited power allows you to focus on learning and practicing the basics without the distraction of of power you can't handle. Anyhow, an M600 has plenty of get-go, people understimate just how little power you 'need' to get yourself in a world of trouble.
Even a small bike like the NT-650 with 45hp has the gitty-up to get you around a track...

 

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I have to counter Tarik here.

Having too much bike for a beginner isn't about entering a turn at a speed greater than your ability can handle. As you say yourself, any bike is capable of doing that, if the rider lets it.

Too much bike generally means either

1) too heavy for the inexperienced rider to manage at low speed, or
2) too torquey or too nonlinear in power delivery causing problems with traction especially coming out of corners.

For 1, there's very little weight difference between a 600 and a 1000.

For 2, other than low speed bucking, the Monsters are
 
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Discussion Starter #20
At any rate, it only took me 300 miles of riding the new 900 when I found myself in the oncoming lane, having underestimated the speed at which I had entered a turn in western MA in October.
 
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