S4R new owner : clutch and maintenance problem - Ducati Monster Forums: Ducati Monster Motorcycle Forum
 
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post #1 of 5 (permalink) Old 08-18-2019, 09:53 AM Thread Starter
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S4R new owner : clutch and maintenance problem

Hi, I bought a S4R 2004 in remplacement of my Vmax this spring!

I began to do some maintenance check and I found that the last owner wasnt very strict on those...
Yesterday, I bleeded the clutch oil and cleaned the slave cylinder, but I had some problem with the clutch transmission rod, this one didnt want to go out..
Why is it happening?

I leave it there unclean with a little grease and had some difficulty to reinstalled the clutch transmission unit..
The ride after, I feeled some restriction in first gear when it engage (but not when im already rolling).
Any thouhgt?

One last thing, the clutch housing is damaged, see attach picture.
Im new to the Ducati dry clutch rumble, but I fought it pretty loud on my bike..
Is it possible that the gap with the clutch plates are to big?
If I need to change the housing, what other piece should I buy (plates spring, bearing)?
Will I need the specific tools..?

Thank for your help!
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ElliafBag is offline  
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post #2 of 5 (permalink) Old 08-18-2019, 11:42 AM
s4r
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Location: Sleman, Yogyakarta, Java, Indonesia
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Garage
Hi,

Replace it with a EVR CDU-200

https://www.omniaracing.net/en/evr-z...m-p-12788.html

I have one in my S4R too


https://www.ducatimonster.org/forums...uals-free.html

Always the First, Always the Best.
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post #3 of 5 (permalink) Old 08-19-2019, 10:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ElliafBag View Post
Hi, I bought a S4R 2004 in remplacement of my Vmax this spring!

I began to do some maintenance check and I found that the last owner wasnt very strict on those...
Yesterday, I bleeded the clutch oil and cleaned the slave cylinder, but I had some problem with the clutch transmission rod, this one didnt want to go out..
Why is it happening?
Which way did you remove it from? It's supposed to be removed by pulling it out from the left side of the motor. However, it tends to get stuck in the pressure plate and can come out the right side when you pull the pressure plate off. On the right side, the rod fits into a metal cone piece which then fits into a bearing in the pressure plate. If the bearing feels gritty or worn out then it should be replaced. Otherwise, I'd just grease the contact points. If the rod is excessively oily on the left side where it fits into the slave then I'd replace the O rings on it.


Quote:
One last thing, the clutch housing is damaged, see attach picture.
Im new to the Ducati dry clutch rumble, but I fought it pretty loud on my bike..
Is it possible that the gap with the clutch plates are to big?
If I need to change the housing, what other piece should I buy (plates spring, bearing)?
Will I need the specific tools..?

Thank for your help!
The housing is called the clutch basket. Yours doesn't look that bad. It's normal for some grooves to wear into the slots over time. Mine was significantly worse when I changed it.

However, the tangs on your clutch plates are really worn out. The gap between the sides of the tangs and sides of the slots in the basket shouldn't be that large and it will definitely cause excessive noise as it leaves room for the clutch plates to rattle back and forth when you're in neutral. In the last pic: follow the vertical right side edge of the tang down and you'll see it forms a little step before continuing into the radius of the disc. The right side of that step shows how wide the tang originally was.

If it still shifts ok then whether or not you want to start replacing parts is up to you. Check out desmotimes.com They sell supplemental maintenance manuals that are really good.

And this site shows a detailed clutch change and goes into what to look for http://teamghettoracing.com/mechanic...ti-dry-clutch/ It's for an S2R but I believe the S4R clutch is essentially the same.
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post #4 of 5 (permalink) Old 08-19-2019, 10:06 PM Thread Starter
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Yeah, i try to remove the rod from the left side, while I was cleaning the slave cylinder.
I only go to the right side to rapidly inspect the clutch.

So you are telling me that the basket isnt so bad?
If I change the clutch plate and the springs, will the noise from the clutch be reduce?
Will I need the special tool (88713.2133) to remove the spring and the pressure plate?
The workshop manual use it, but not the tutorials that I find online.

One last question, is the bearing hard to remove and reinstall?

Thanks for your help!
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post #5 of 5 (permalink) Old 08-20-2019, 10:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ElliafBag View Post
So you are telling me that the basket isnt so bad?
Not really. I mean, it isn't great but mine was a lot worse when I changed it and it was still shifting ok prior to that. If you want, you could pull it out and use a metal file to smooth the inside edges of the slots.

Quote:
If I change the clutch plate and the springs, will the noise from the clutch be reduce?
It should. It won't go away completely due to the nature of it being a dry clutch but it should be noticeably reduced. Mine used to be loud enough that the sound of the plates banging around was louder than my engine and exhaust as idle.

Another note, most websites that sell new clutch plates sell them as a kit with the steel discs that sit between the plates. You don't necessarily have to change the steel discs though. I pulled mine out and sanded them just enough to restore the surface to bare metal and then cleaned them with brake cleaner. However, you will want to lay them on a completely flat surface, like a glass table, to ensure they are still straight. They can warp a little bit and any warped discs should be replaced. I only had to replace two of mine. I originally did not check to see if any were warped and had issues with the clutch not fully disengaging due to a combination of the plates being warped and the new clutch discs having thicker friction material than the old worn out ones.

Quote:
Will I need the special tool (88713.2133) to remove the spring and the pressure plate?
The workshop manual use it, but not the tutorials that I find online.
For just the springs and plates, no.

If you want to remove the clutch basket you will need a tool to hold the clutch basket in place to break the bolts loose. I used this one and it worked great: https://www.ebay.com/itm/Ducati-Clut...YAAMXQBuNQ6lCZ


Quote:
One last question, is the bearing hard to remove and reinstall?

Thanks for your help!
Not really. I laid mine face up on two pieces of wood 2x6's leaving a gap under the bearing. Then I put a socket over the face of the bearing and hammered it out. I put the new bearing in a freezer overnight to shrink it as much as possible and then used the same socket and hammer to press it into the pressure plate. It's a crude method but it worked...just gotta be careful not to damage the bearing.


Couple more notes:

Desmotimes sells a spyder spring retainer that replaces that OEM spring cups. It helps improve the lever feel and isn't too expensive.

The Oberson slave cylinder is also a very nice upgrade. It makes the lever pull a lot lighter and smoother.

Try and find the factory service manual for your model. The section on changing the clutch will specify the correct thickness for the steel plates and clutch discs as well as provide a range for what their "stack height" should be which is the total thickness of the steel plates and clutch discs when they're all stacked together. It's a good idea to double-check that before you reassemble everything. I recommend using a digital caliper to measure them.
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