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Old 08-24-2011, 08:00 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Default Buying ducati WITHOUT red key or code card

I'm thinking of buying 2007 ducati monster 695, and i was doing some research and came across black keys, red keys and code card.
from what i understand, you need the red key to program any new black keys, and the code card is for when some reason your programmed black key isn't working and you DONT have your red key at the time, so you will have to play with the throttle in order to start it up again.
so without a red key, i'm pretty much screwed at getting any copies and if i lose my only black keys, i'll have to sell an arm or leg or maybe both to get a whole new dash?
also, how likely is it for my black keys to randomly stop working, thus having to use the code card to start it back up?
Please correct me if im wrong at any point. i'm not familiar with Ducati and different keys.
anyways the seller does not have the red key or code card.
should i still proceed with this deal? what type of problems will i run into without the red key or code card?
i know there's key thrift in San Francisco, and i was planning to clone several more black keys just to be safe.
others suggested that if i upgrade the pipes i'll also need to get a new ECU.
with a new ECU, would that mean theres no programmed keys?
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Old 08-24-2011, 08:56 PM   #2 (permalink)
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The black keys can be cloned, any locksmith should be able to do it, It'll just cost a touch more than a spare key, I got quoted $40. Normally if you upgrade to a DP ECU the red key becomes redundant. My S4R was in the same boat, but the service history was good etc so I went through with it. As long as the rest of the bike checks out I would still go ahead with buying it, just get your black key cloned so you have a spare lying around. Never heard of them just stopping working.
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Old 08-24-2011, 09:04 PM   #3 (permalink)
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okay thanks a lot. the seller has 2 black keys. i might just end up getting 1 or 2 more to be safe.
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Old 08-25-2011, 10:53 AM   #4 (permalink)
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have you used any of the "cloned" black keys? one of the codes on the card is a key code to reproduce keys. additionally, the keys have transponders that correlate with the bikes ecu which is why they are so specific.
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Old 08-25-2011, 11:11 AM   #5 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by uglyducky View Post
the keys have transponders that correlate with the bikes ecu which is why they are so specific.
That's true, and I can't imagine how a locksmith could duplicate these keys properly, but not all Ducatis use transponders. Anybody know which year they introduced this? I assume they had them in '07.
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Old 08-25-2011, 06:29 PM   #6 (permalink)
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I would assume it's just like my truck key I recently had to make. The locksmith put the key in a computer, took it out, cut the new key to the same as the original, then put the copy in the computer. He was able to change the RF or whatever to match the original. I usually don't check spares but I certainly checked that one. It worked just fine. However I don't have a Chevy "red key" and I don't program the new key from the ECU.

The point of the red key is that it IS the computer that the locksmith used to duplicate my truck key. When you use the red key procedure, the red key authorizes the ECU to program the incoming key. When you place the new key into the ignition, the ECU will upload the information to the blank.

If it were me, I'd take a ride down to the locksmith with the owner and have him pay to make a copy. Run back to the bike (or just ride it over) and check the key. If it works, then you have 2 copies and you'll be at ease. Call ahead to the local locksmith and ask if they have Ducati key blanks with the RF chip. If not, then you can order them from Ebay and there are now a few other places that sell the blanks for a reasonable amount. Keep in mind that with all this new technology that is supposed to make our lives so much more wonderful, that your new key may cost anywhere between $40-$100. I'd like to know what happened to the days of $1.09 key copies.
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Old 08-25-2011, 07:20 PM   #7 (permalink)
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From what i understand, i think 2001-2007 use a red key to program the other black keys. I also know that you cannot get a duplicate red key, so if you lose it, your SOL and cannot make another spare key without it. Ducati does not keep copies of your red key and will not send you a new one. Sure a locksmith can make a duplicate, but it will only be good for opening the trunk or a nice paper weight. The only way to get a new set of keys is to purchase a new ECU, dash and red and black keys along with the code card.
Code card needed to disable the immobilizer just in case your key doesnt work.

More info here in another thread: http://www.ducatimonster.org/forums/...d-red-key.html

Last edited by giantdefy; 08-25-2011 at 07:25 PM.
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Old 08-25-2011, 08:32 PM   #8 (permalink)
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I've heard several stories that many locksmith's have a computer that reads the RF signal and duplicates it onto the new key. Thus the theory that it is only good for unlocking the steering and the seat is invalid. The black key is programmed with the correct RF signal when the ECU is allowed to program the new key by the use of the red key. However modern times have created other ways to copy the RF signal and program it onto another key blank. Before you could buy blanks on the open market you could not get a key duplicated, now you can.

If your theory is correct that the locksmith cannot duplicate the RF signal, then answer me as to how they programmed my new truck key by using the original on my key ring? My truck has an immobilizer built into it but you don't use a special key to program it.
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Old 08-26-2011, 12:21 AM   #9 (permalink)
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Call the Scottish guy in Maine. He did mine for $25. He has been in this business for 20 years now.

http://www.allmotorcyclekeys.com/
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Old 05-30-2013, 06:10 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Jim, the Scotsman, is a delightful person. Call him. He sold me some blank black keys. I took them to Martin Lock & Key near Arlington, Texas. An assistant cloned my black keys in just a few minutes and gave me the code read-out for the two codes from the programmer. She had no idea that it was supposed to be an impossible job. She just took care of business and poof, more keys! Amazing how stupid the lies are about what you can't do without the red key. The dealers have told the biggest lies of all.
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